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Mike's avatar

youre very compassionate man Leon. i honestly dont know how i survived attemped murder as small child amd the horros that followed for decades but I have

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Leon Macfayden's avatar

Thanks that means a lot. I'm shocked by your comment - you survived someone trying to kill you and then decades of abuse? I can't imagine the trauma that must have caused you.

I'm so glad you survived all that and are still here.

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Mike's avatar

No simple answer to that . 🙏

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Mike's avatar

yes my father now deceased was a homicidal maniac on drink thats in fiorst 3-4 yearsthen physical abandoment manytimes, emotional abandonement 100% of the ime ,but not only me my mother and many years late a sister. then age 9-13 sexual abuse ,,psychiatric abuse n trhe south africa defnece force for being a conscientious objecter.(truth drug induce psychotic brak,2 more followed over the next 20 years ..the 4 th one almost induced by psychotic dysfuntional narcisstic large family sibling ,members almost but foruntely never happened partly due to 13 tears of intensive meditation since the 3rd one . , - i started to escape the intergenerational abuse just in time - and I came to start to put the pieces together thaats therpay had not been able to enough as im still doing with the help of the other survivors that support each other in the pvt group run by https://familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/ @rebecca mandeville now im 70. i wish i could make a movie of it .......be quite a psycholgical thriller LOL ..glad to have met you Leon and hopefully to continue reading your woderfully inspiring writing.

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April Daniels's avatar

Mike, I have the utmost respect for your survival and healing. Thank you for writing it. Thank you.

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Cherales's avatar

Thank you for sharing this as you have; I have lost a friend to suicide, for some time I’ve thought what else I could have done all those years ago.

Yet, two of my closest family members are thankfully still with us all now, despite their own suicide attempts. I’m so very glad that they were and remain such close and loving parts of my life.

I also hope your words help others in some way, thanks again for sharing this.

x

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Leon Macfayden's avatar

Thanks so much. I'm sorry for the loss of your friend and relieved that you still have your family members. How are they doing now?

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Scott Ninneman/SpeakingBipolar's avatar

Thank you for helping raise awareness, Leon. Asking can do so much. No one knew how bad I was until they found my at a table covered with pills, but later friends said they thought something was wrong but were afraid to ask. Things could have been stopped much earlier if someone had just asked me.

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Leon Macfayden's avatar

Yes people are scared of putting the thought in your mind even though it's the silence that actually kills people.

Thank goodness they found you in time.

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April Daniels's avatar

Oh Leon, thank you so much for this post. Suicide, particularly men committing suicide, is a topic that cuts straight to my heart.

Sadly, tragically, unfortunately...there isn't an adverb that I can use to introduce my despair-- that I have known too many boys and men who have committed suicide. I've known girls and women also, but the ratio of men I've know who have committed suicide is much higher.

I wonder about those ratios. And, I don't have an answer. I simply know it's a tragic problem that I have dedicated a significant portion of my life and efforts to try to prevent.

Disclosure: I am a child sex abuse survivor. As a child, I was routinely abused by older teenage boys. Typically, I was abused with 2-3 other little boys my age.

To my knowledge, only one of those little boys have dealt with and acknowledged the sexual abuse he suffered as a child. ONE. And, by the way, he's doing fabulous. I talk to him regularly.

To his knowledge, he's the only little boy who was brave enough to deal with it (from our childhood neighborhood).

We know that several of the little boys are now dead via suicide, drug overdoses and tragic accidents. Most of 'em didn't even reach the age of 30.

Is there a tie between little boys sexually abused as children and suicide? I don't know. I certainly can't prove it and the statics don't back it up.

For now, I just know, that men typically commit suicide more than women. And, it's horrific.

Thank you for posting this, and please, let's keep this discussion going. Thank you so much.

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Leon Macfayden's avatar

Thank you for all your support and for sharing your story. I can't imagine what you went through - it's beyond words.

I think there's a tie between sexual abuse in general and suicide. At least anecdotally, the suicidal people I've met - both the attempts and the completed - often had lived through rape or other abuses when younger, and often by family members.

Perhaps if you combine the abuse with many men's inability to express themselves when hurting, and lack of a support system, it's a deadly concoction.

Also when men do attempt suicide, they typically use more violent methods which leads to greater completion. Again, not sure why, other than men being more aggressive than women in a general sense.

All supposition on my part but I think you may be on to something.

Again, I'm so glad you're here, so glad I met you and so glad you survived.

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April Daniels's avatar

Oh Leon, Thank you. I am so grateful I survived also. Every. Single. Day.

Very insightful comments about men and sexual abuse -- and the ties to suicide.

I hope by writing and talking openly about little boys being sexually abused will help diminish the stigma. It's not a victims fault. EVER. No matter what nonsense the perp and frequently ignorant people spew about the victimization.

Blaming the victim is such a well known tactic that it officially has a name now: DARVO.

The shame and guilt that comes with sexual assault enhances the victim's vulnerability to DARO attacks--and can pile on the guilt and shame the victim already experiences. Then, as you so insightfully commented, "...many men's inability to express themselves when hurting, and lack of a support system, it's a deadly concoction."

To those reading this, if you've been sexually abused: it's not your fault. If you are male reading this--in particular--sexual abuse is a crime of domination--not sex. It's not your fault. Stay on this earth. Your life is sacred and precious.

Thank you again Leon, and I am so grateful for your work and our connection.

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Leon Macfayden's avatar

And on top of all that, for those survivors who come forward, the justice system can be a further traumatic experience. In theory there are measures in place to make it as painless as possible. In practice, it’s still painful and the measures aren’t always adhered to.

I recently heard of a case where someone was STILL blamed for her assault because of what she was wearing. It’s a symptom of a more general problem. Frequently I see women opening up on social media about sexual violence and/or violence in general perpetrated against them. Without exception, every comment section has men writing comments like “What did she do to deserve it? We only have half the story”.

The problem is men. And even when some men are victims, they are overwhelmingly the victims of other men. As a man, I hate to say it, but we need to say it until it changes.

Thank you as well - it’s great to have these discussions and work together to help others. You’re doing amazing work!

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April Daniels's avatar

Last year, I wrote a piece for survivors about "Reporting to the Police." My main focus is with victims/survivors of sexual assault. As of 2024, I concluded that it's up to the victim/survivor if they want to report to the police because the whole process is traumatic.

I cited a study of women, in the USA, "Unfounded Sexual Assault: Women’s Experiences of Not Being Believed by the Police,"

--https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9136376/

The study was published in 2022, and it's quite disheartening.

I can't even imagine how a stereotypical macho man police officer would treat, or respond to a male sexual assault survivor. Based on the report about women reporting, I have a strong hunch men would not be believed either.

This report caused a little bit of action to try to train police officers in the USA about DARVO (https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/what-is-darvo).

Then, if the victim/survivor has the courage to keep pushing, then they go through the Court system. And, DARVO is frequently used to discredit the victims.

With all that said, we still must keep talking to try to let people know that it is NEVER a victims fault.

I hope I haven't hijacked this conversation. I don't believe that all men who attempt or succeed at committing suicide have been sexually assaulted. It's just that in my experience, I have known far to many beautiful men who were sexually abused as children and committed suicide.

And, Leon, I have the same feeling about you. I am so grateful for your work and everything you do. And, I am especially glad to have your male, enlightened pespective!

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Leon Macfayden's avatar

I was about to write that I think UK police are more sympathetic than their US counterparts, but I just had several incidents I know of flash before my eyes and I can’t guarantee that.

A few years ago, 2 sisters were in a park in London in the early hours after a birthday celebration. They were waving fairy lights around and taking photos and having fun. A random stranger stalked them down and stabbed them to death before leaving them in a bush.

The police decided to leave them there overnight so a post mortem could be carried out in situ. Police would guard the scene overnight.

2 officers breached the crime scene and took selfie style photos with the victims. They complained to a group chat of 40 other officers that they would be late going home because “I’m stuck in a field with a couple of stabbed up dead birds”. Some of the officers reported them and they got just under 3 years in prison.

So no I cannot guarantee that the UK police are more sympathetic. It’s a lottery as to who turns up.

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April Daniels's avatar

ugh, that makes me sick.

My hope is that those 2 officers were the the exception and therefore newsworthy. I so want to believe that police officers are motivated to protect and help people. Not to exert some weird dominance over others because they are so insecure and weak themselves.

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FailedCleon's avatar

A planned suicide can avoid death by horrible injuries or attacks like stabbing/getting shot with some positives of having to not get shit on in every interactions or have to go through many designed humiliation rituals of normie life and some negatives of missing out new anime episodes and interesting world events. What would fix everything in my case is having an ethical way to have a persistent private room where I would be left alone, have food, bathroom and internet connection but that's an impossibility.

Unfortunately picking out a safe and effective method that doesn't negatively affect others is too complicated, has high social costs and all around too much work. I gotta at least get to the point of being homeless before having the privilage of considering it seriously but that timeline also increases the chance of dying an unusual death and go through extra layers of suffering through more sickness & disease. There is no escape.

Sorry for using your comment box to self ramble, I do agree the impulsive and accidental with drug abuse and mental health caused suicides should be reduced and having other safe and alternative channels that are not too much work will let those people misuse the tool, so not like I'm suggesting anything useful.

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Leon Macfayden's avatar

I’m sorry to read you are having these thoughts. When you wrote “What would fix everything in my case is having an ethical way to have a persistent private room”, is that because your pain comes from relationships with others?

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FailedCleon's avatar

Definately, I'd really prefer to be left alone without introducing huge risks/dangers but that's not an option. An imaginary world where everything still functions the same automatically but everyone else lives in a different physical dimension would be one of the near perfect ideal.

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Leon Macfayden's avatar

I felt that way for a long time. I barely left my house for over 10 years. I really disliked people and that's a feeling I've had to work very hard to overcome.

TBH I still prefer being at home and being around too many people drains me.

Is this something you feel you could overcome?

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FailedCleon's avatar

I don't believe it's someting that needs overcoming in my particular situation since it's not anything like anxiety. If I ever get the luxery of being able to live alone, it'd fix 99% of the problems, the rest of the 1% from there would be pretty easy. I appriciate you sharing about your life and experience on your article and here though.

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Michael Berger, LSW's avatar

This was powerful and gut-wrenching. Thank you for your honesty—and for holding space for a conversation most people still avoid. You’re absolutely right: we don’t need men to “tough it out,” we need to create cultures where they’re safe enough to speak it out.

The details—the folded clothes, the bag-for-life moment, the midnight birthday call—these stay with you. They remind us that suffering often wears a polite mask until it’s too heavy to hold.

I write in A Little Bit Kinder about how kindness and connection aren’t fluff—they’re survival tools. We need to build worlds where asking for help is strength, not shame. alittlebitkinder.substack.com

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Salwa 🇬🇧's avatar

Leon, this was such a powerful, sobering, and necessary read. Thank you for writing it with so much clarity, honesty, and compassion. That image of the clothes folded in the bus shelter will stay with me....it says so much about the pain, the intention, and the quiet way many men suffer without ever letting the world in.

You’ve laid out the complexity of male suicide so well...the layers of pressure, silence, shame, and disconnection that so often go unnoticed until it’s too late. And I really appreciated your reminder that asking someone if they’re suicidal doesn’t cause harm...it can actually open a door that saves a life.

Thank you for doing this work, for sharing your experiences, and for reminding us that no one is beyond reaching. This conversation matters deeply, and I’m grateful you’re helping lead it

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Leon Macfayden's avatar

Thanks so much that means a lot.

Yes I’ve replayed that image of the folded clothes thousands of times since. I guess it’s because it doesn’t make sense to me. The neat orderliness of it stood in such contrast to the devastation it represented.

Wishing you all the best for today.

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Seeker of Resonance's avatar

Very well written and thoughtful post. It is tragic what our minds can cause us to do when everything feels like too much.

I struggle with mental health and have just this year started therapy, mainly because my employer covers 20 sessions a year because otherwise I likely wouldn't because of the cost.

It has been interesting so far and despite the voice in my head often telling me it is a waste of time and wanting several times to stop I keep showing up to my appointments and trying my best to get what I can from them.

My therapist encouraged me to seek a psychiatrist and potentially medication to stabilize my moods as she diagn6me as bipolar but again, the potential financial costs have prevented me from doing so. I won't lie there is likely some aspect of the male tendency to expect ourselves to be self reliant and not need help at play, but it feels mostly like a money thing.

It's honestly what drives most of my stress, worry about money and future uncertainty. To tie into this post I have verbalized to my wife several times in an emotional state that I can understand why people choose to end it. This has been times where I have worked myself up over something I'm anxious about to the point where it feels like everything is hopeless, and that nothing will ever improve because the worry and anxiety have blocked all the light and all I see is the darkness in that moment. I shouldn't say all the light because even in the moments where I've said that to her I don't want to do it, I just can sympathize with how people can get to that point.

I loved the man shed program and it would be really cool to start something like that if I can get in a better place mentally, because honestly most days I feel mostly guided by inertia and have for quite some time lacked any real ambition or drive...I think and my therapist also suggests I could be on the spectrum. I think I spent so many years in survival mode and trying to do it all myself that I suffered a pretty severe burnout.

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Leon Macfayden's avatar

Thanks for sharing your story and struggles. I felt the exact same way about therapy. I also had very bad therapists which didn’t help. But as a police officer I felt like a fraud sitting there going on about my troubles when I’m supposed to be the helper.

Eventually I realised that there is strength in vulnerability. Sometimes I have paid for therapists and psychiatrists, other times they have been covered by the NHS. I can’t say I noticed any difference in quality.

You have a great insight into how you understand the suicidal mindset, but you don’t see yourself going through with it. I’m so relieved to hear that and it shows you can trust your wife if you can open up like that.

How have you found therapy so far? It sounds like the stress of everything is adding together and proving difficult for you to manage. Hopefully they can help you untangle some of that. Wishing you all the best!

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Seeker of Resonance's avatar

Therapy has been really interesting so far. It's given me a chance to be seen and care for my self to begin healing past issues that I never learned how to and have just tried my best to cope with.

I feel like the things I've learned through therapy and the independent study I've engaged in to learn different strategies from different therapy modalities has really shifted my thinking about my struggles.

One of my favorite therapies, although not one my therapist uses specifically is internal family systems. The idea that the parts of myself that create negative effects in my life are not "bad" but often just wounded parts that are being protected by other parts has been fascinating to consider.

I have two kids one 7 and one 3 and although I wish I had pursued therapy years ago I'm glad to be doing it now to try to become a more effective parent and pass on less of the dysfunction that was given to me.

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Sean Corcoran's avatar

Great writing, Leon. thank you

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Leon Macfayden's avatar

Thanks so much!

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Mark V Smallwood's avatar

A deeply insightful piece - painfully accurate - read it and share it.

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Leon Macfayden's avatar

Thanks so much!

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